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A Blind Bandit's Ears

vanga
Dec 22, 2006 21:57:43 GMT -6

Post by vanga on Dec 22, 2006 21:57:43 GMT -6

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Here's something that I've picked up on in past posts and am curious to get opinions on. This thread doesn't have the potential to become a terribly long discussion, just something for a few people to throw down their opinions:

People state that Toph, being blind, has terribly good hearing. This is somewhat true of most blind people, who have their other senses enhanced due to the loss of sight. However, has Toph really lost her sight? She 'sees' using earthbending, so would the loss of normal optical function still have any effect on her other senses or is her hearing the same as the average joe?
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Last edit by vanga: Dec 22, 2006 21:58:13 GMT -6
nightshade
Dec 22, 2006 22:09:16 GMT -6

Post by nightshade on Dec 22, 2006 22:09:16 GMT -6

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I would belevie that it would be incredibly hard to find the words to discribe how she 'sees' so that is just how she says it to bypass any complicated discussion. It's true that her hearing may be much more hightened than a normal person but it is her sence of touch that is what she means by 'seeing'

I'm still tring to wrap my head around your last sentance but I guess it's a little confusing what you're tring to say.
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Last edit by vanga: Dec 22, 2006 22:09:49 GMT -6
vanga
Dec 22, 2006 22:13:29 GMT -6

Post by vanga on Dec 22, 2006 22:13:29 GMT -6

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Last sentence: Would the loss of seeing with the eyes effect her other senses or would her hearing be the same as any other's.

Also, we see how she 'sees' in the first episode that we meet her in the series. It had several instances where normal vision was altered into 'Toph Vision' (Ha, I made that up XP). It can't simply be 'feeling the vibrations' because not only does she know where others are, she can see their shape due to how the vibrations travel over them. How would touch help her there, when all the vibrations are coming to her in the same way through the ground?
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nightshade
Dec 22, 2006 22:35:52 GMT -6

Post by nightshade on Dec 22, 2006 22:35:52 GMT -6

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Well, that wouldn't be how she truly sees. Since she had been blind since birth the best she could, most likely, come up with would be a vague outline. You take it a step further that she has no concept of color it would be hard to say what she if really seeing. She's using what would be called Ecolocation (Similar to echolocation. Eco-earth) Let me explain: As we had seen in The Blind Bandit she sends out a primary vibration towards where ever she needs it. Depending on the objects size she can determine how much resistance the said object is putting up thus know it's size. Larger the object the more vibrations will hit it. Secondly, depending on how much of the vibration the object absorbs she can determine what the object is. (Ex, a large rock will deflect vibrations while the human body can absorb them due to it's high water concentration and malleability) Then again, if the object is moving she'll know it since it's own vibration will be felt by Toph anyways. The vibrations arn't all unifrom. They will differ in strengh.

That would be ecolocation in a nutshell. There could also be other factors such as air pressure but to our knowledge we don't have anything to go on there. It's hard to say what she sees since she had been blind since birth. Most likely it would be very vague in detail but know enough about what it is to do something. Man, that took awhile to think up.


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Last edit by vanga: Dec 22, 2006 22:37:40 GMT -6
xarrase
Dec 23, 2006 3:17:07 GMT -6

Post by xarrase on Dec 23, 2006 3:17:07 GMT -6

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Well her hearing, in my opinion, is somewhat advanced, but that is not how she 'sees.' If you remember in the "Blind Bandit" episode, Toph could not see Aang when he was in the air. And the vibrations in the air are technically sound, so Toph does not see through sound.

In "Serpents Pass" Toph attempted to cross a small amount of ice between a rock and a hard surface. As Toph takes a step on the ice, she says: "No thanks, I'd rather stay here where I can see."

Also, in that desert library episode, while she is flying on Appa, she says: "Look, there it is! That's what it would sound like if one of us spotted it." while she waves her hand in front of her face, signifying she cannot see. Later on in the episode, she is on the sand and complains about how "everything is all fuzzy."

In conclusion, Toph does not 'see' with her hearing, rather, as stated in the show, she 'feels the vibrations in the earth.'
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Last edit by vanga: Dec 23, 2006 3:17:57 GMT -6
bugcatcher
Dec 23, 2006 14:30:29 GMT -6

Post by bugcatcher on Dec 23, 2006 14:30:29 GMT -6

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In agreement with the post above, when Toph sensed Iroh she moved one of her feet to be perpendicular with the other, which would give a sense of precise location, as one foot would sense latitude, the other longitude. (per say)
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genome
Dec 23, 2006 14:38:08 GMT -6

Post by genome on Dec 23, 2006 14:38:08 GMT -6

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vanga said:
Here's something that I've picked up on in past posts and am curious to get opinions on. This thread doesn't have the potential to become a terribly long discussion, just something for a few people to throw down their opinions:

People state that Toph, being blind, has terribly good hearing. This is somewhat true of most blind people, who have their other senses enhanced due to the loss of sight. However, has Toph really lost her sight? She 'sees' using earthbending, so would the loss of normal optical function still have any effect on her other senses or is her hearing the same as the average joe?


I think it did effect her hearing. I think were other senses are enhanced, since her "seeing through earth bending" is far similar to enhanced touch. Earth Banding is a skill, and by touching earth, she sees the vibrations in her head. Also she has proved to distinct people through their voices, and can remember someone from that. Also, in the desert episode, it was very difficult to distinguish what that one man said, and she heard it clearly as "Put a Muzzle on It." So I would say that her other senses are enhanced, and she does not have sight, but only sees because of her enhanced sense of touch.
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spirit300
Dec 23, 2006 23:07:48 GMT -6

Post by spirit300 on Dec 23, 2006 23:07:48 GMT -6

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we've established that Toph has enhanced touch from her earthbending sight. as Kaito mentioned, Toph never forgets a voice. I believe all of her senses are enhanced, because her eyesight is still gone. Her ability to feel vibrations is just extremely good. Of course, you could also think that because her sense for touch is so good, her other senses may not be enhanced as well.
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genome
Dec 24, 2006 18:16:08 GMT -6

Post by genome on Dec 24, 2006 18:16:08 GMT -6

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spirit300 said:
Of course, you could also think that because her sense for touch is so good, her other senses may not be enhanced as well.


Well, I think that all of her senses are enhanced because of her lost sense of sight. Then, because of Earth Bending, her sense of touch is even greater enhanced, so it's like this: she has no sense of sight, enhanced hearing, enhanced smell, average sense of sound (vocal), and awesome sens eof touch (enhanced + enhanced more from Earth Bending.) This will make sense, though I may be wrong.
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vanga
Dec 27, 2006 21:29:49 GMT -6

Post by vanga on Dec 27, 2006 21:29:49 GMT -6

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Well, here's a thought. Since the lack of a sense strengthens the others, wouldn't the superiority of a sense likewise weaken the others? If her sense of touch is so strong that she uses it to get around as she does, ontop of its traditional use, and since it probably forms a picture in her mind of her surroundings, you would assume its acting as two senses. Perhaps that was enough compansation for her loss of sight and thus the other senses had no need to rise for her benefit.
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Last edit by vanga: Dec 27, 2006 21:30:12 GMT -6