hieu
Oct 16, 2006 17:55:40 GMT -6
Post by hieu on Oct 16, 2006 17:55:40 GMT -6
^^that definatly deserves a praisal and poitn to the karma.
wow that was one hell of a good post. But i guess i'm just narrow minded right now and not thinking about that lol. But i kinda got that idea when i said it was Boomi who suggest that Aang seek a different teacher.
raansu
Oct 19, 2006 13:25:03 GMT -6
Post by raansu on Oct 19, 2006 13:25:03 GMT -6
Defiantly Toph because she earthbends at a hole different level then boomi because she is blind. Being blind makes her toatally rely on earthbending which in turn makes her better at eartbending. Boomi may have raw strength but Toph would be able to dodge or stop his attacks easily because she would fell the vibrations and counter attack imediately. Say if someone did a doouble attack a giant boulder from the front and a small spike from the back, toph would block both becasue she would feel the vibrations of the 2, unlike boomi who would probally just block the first one relying on his eye sight and not seeing the spike from behind. Plus boomi and Toph would never fight because boomi likes to think that he listens to the earth and knows when and when not to fight and I'm pretty sure the earth would tell boomi to stay the f**k wawy from Toph and that it was time to be neutral!!!
niu
Oct 24, 2006 3:44:44 GMT -6
Post by niu on Oct 24, 2006 3:44:44 GMT -6
I would say Toph, because she's already near Bumi's level and she is waaay younger. Bumi's had like, 100 years of expierience. With a few more years, Toph will totally pwn him. But on terms of raw charisma, I say the hands down winner is Bumi. He is completley bonkers, it's hilarious! I love his weird disproportianate eyes. My favourite quote of his is when he goes "Lettuce Leaves?" when Katara demands 'Let us leave!' whilst calmly eating lettuce, with that insane music in the background. That had me in hysterics. I don't think Toph could ever be that funny. But she is kick-ass. ;D
xaolin0091
Nov 4, 2006 19:46:44 GMT -6
Post by xaolin0091 on Nov 4, 2006 19:46:44 GMT -6
I think Boomi would win. When Aang returns to New Ozai (Omashu) he tries to rescue King Boomi. Boomi tells him he can't teach him now and he will find someone that understands positive, negative and neutral Jin. Therefore Boomi already knew about Toph. Also, from what I have seen, Boomi has infinite power when it comes to earhbending even when he is locked in a steel coffin. Toph is very good but Boomi is the Ultimate.
spongebob
Nov 5, 2006 18:28:18 GMT -6
Post by spongebob on Nov 5, 2006 18:28:18 GMT -6
I think Boomi is better because in all the episodes that I have seen him in, I have watched him create huge rocks and walls of Earth. Wherever King Boomi is he is able to create some type of earth bending attack.
cobar
Nov 29, 2006 20:29:55 GMT -6
Post by cobar on Nov 29, 2006 20:29:55 GMT -6
Toph, because of her unique styke of earth bending. She also seems more intuned with the earth because of her blindness IMO.
karl
Nov 30, 2006 18:39:13 GMT -6
Post by karl on Nov 30, 2006 18:39:13 GMT -6
Hm... You know, comparing Bumi to Toph is not entirely unlike comparing Ozai to Azula. Azula and Toph are both considered prodigies, to have become that high of a level at such a young age. Ozai and Bumi both are extremely powerful and have full mastery of their element in a way that allows them to manipulate said element with tried and true methods of varying types yet both with amazing effects. Toph, with her Praying Mantis style and Azula's hotter fire make them pioneers. Metaphorical speaking aside, Bumi would win because of his experience and mastery of Earth. Bumi knows all the tricks in the book, including most of Toph's.Bumi would win, but it wouldn't be totally one sided.
I just want to mention that Earthbending doesn't have the element of surprise like Firebending, so that is why I say Azula>Ozai...
vanga
Dec 2, 2006 17:28:53 GMT -6
Post by vanga on Dec 2, 2006 17:28:53 GMT -6
I suppose there will always be squabbles over matters still open for debate for lack of evidence either way, but I don't even see this as an issue. Bumi is an Earthbending master, a "master"! That means he's not simply a child prodegy with the skills that Toph has, but also the experiance and wisdom that comes with age.
Everyone quickly seems to jump to Toph's unique style and blindness, but a true master would finally observe a way around that, where the average bender would not. One reason why I see so many people siding with the blind prodegy is because she's seen far more action in the show then Bumi. There's plenty of material to fall back on and show how great a bender she is in her art.
However, for the most part she has been battling against the average benders. True, she did wonders against the Dai Li, but even they were simply a uniform sect of above average Earthbenders. They were still by no means masters of the art. If she ever battles against a truely powerful Earthbender, I think she'll find herself in a little bit too deep for her liking.
@kiku - I rather disagree with the Azula being greater than Ozai. After all, the real final battle is far more likely to be the firelord then his daughter and why would the last great opponent Aang has to face be weaker than a previous foe?
amatria
Dec 2, 2006 17:46:40 GMT -6
Post by amatria on Dec 2, 2006 17:46:40 GMT -6
Ok, I vote Toph all the way. Bumi is a strong dude, I will admit. He picked up a whole freakin wall for god's sake. Toph though, would know just how to counteract it. She always comes up with something. I mean, she bent METAL. She rocks out loud, and can easily kick Bumi's butt if she can catch him off guard, but he cannot catch her offguard. If she went under the ground, he would have no idea where she is. If he went under, she could see him.
darkness
Dec 3, 2006 0:00:49 GMT -6
Post by darkness on Dec 3, 2006 0:00:49 GMT -6
Ok, everyone put up good points for Toph's ability to win, a couple for Boomi. But I think Boomi would totally pwn Toph for this simple reason...reasons.
#1:He uses unorthadox styles never using the same tactic more than once in a fight and changes how he fights at every move.
#2:He is stronger, more experianced, and has proably fought with a blind bender before. I mean, he is old.
#3:He has more feel for the earth around him and can use any part of him to bend, Toph may be blind and can sense vibrations but that dosn't make her that intunued with the earth.
#4:Whoopde doo, Toph can bend metal, but chances are, so can Boomi, it hasn't shown it but he has been around for years and proably can bend any thing that has to do with earth.
If you look at the way they fight you can see Boomi is far superior, Toph with her ability to sense attacks would help but with the whole she could block two attaks because of her sight, Boomi would block them just the same for the reason, he would see it comming.
waterbender525
Dec 3, 2006 9:40:02 GMT -6
Post by waterbender525 on Dec 3, 2006 9:40:02 GMT -6
I completely disagree actually. I think Toph could completely destroy King Bumi. Toph has the power to adapt to her surroundings, she learned to adapt to ice, sand, and metal. Toph can bend metal cuz she can sense the refined materials in the metal. She hit the metal and felt the vibrations. Chances are, King Bumi doesn't have the talent of being blind and able to sense vibrations to teach himself how to bend metal. What do you mean he has more FEEL for the earth around him? Does Toph not feel the earth? Don't say the word probably when you are arguing with something because it proves NOTHING at all about the two people. If I said Toph probably could beat Bumi, doesn't mean it's true, Bumi didn't fight a blind bender. Since he is old he is probably brittle, they fight with two completely different styles, I would prefer it if they actually fought in an episode.
kail
Dec 15, 2006 9:11:48 GMT -6
Post by kail on Dec 15, 2006 9:11:48 GMT -6
Who's to say that Bumi wouldn't be able to sense vibrations of the earth as well? All Earthbenders feel vibrations in the earth. It's their element. It would make sense. Toph depends on it for sight, but I wouldn't say she was the only one that could do that. There's a reason why the Earthbenders are mostly barefoot. And that's so they can be more in tune with the earth.
This has been stated before, but bumi has wisdom and a lot more expierience than Toph. Bumi and Aang were best friends back in the day. I'm sure you've all seen that episode where Aang finally realizes it's the same earthbender, cause Bumi comments on Aang not changing at all. etc. etc.
Anywho. Toph is great. Don't get me wrong. Everyone has seen more of Toph than Bumi as well. so it's only natural that they think she's better. But seriously. look who she's been fighting. In the episode where she and Aang were hanging in the metal cages, she fought off all of those guys and their leader, but did you see those guys? There was no strategy in that whatsoever. All those guys depend on is raw strength. Honestly they looked kinda sloppy, in my opinion. They were probably all mastered the basics in earthbending anyway. That whole event was like WWF or WWE or whatever they call it these days. Meaning it's all just for show. Toph has surpassed that level of bending by a long shot. They are no comparison to Toph, who was just toying with them. If those guys were really all they were hyped up to be it wouldn't have been that easy for Toph to do the things she did.
Honestly. Who's to say what Bumi can and can't do? They barely showed him in the show. He's probably got a lot more up his sleeve than any of us know. So until more is seen of both Bumi and Toph, there isn't really much of an answer to this debate.
It's still fun to talk about, though.
bugcatcher
Dec 18, 2006 13:07:58 GMT -6
Post by bugcatcher on Dec 18, 2006 13:07:58 GMT -6
I must refer to the episode yesterday. When Aang challenged Toph in the earthbending arena, Toph could not see him because he used airbending to levitate silently. However, Toph beat a whole legion of earthbenders at the same time, in a cloud of blinding dust. They could hardly see her. Before that, Toph sensed an ambush. I must say, Toph is by far more powerful than King Bumi.
vanga
Dec 18, 2006 16:14:01 GMT -6
Post by vanga on Dec 18, 2006 16:14:01 GMT -6
Again, all Toph has done is battle the weak or lower intermediate of the Earthbenders. She's fought against pro-wrestling rejects and the uniform soldier with relatively average skills. She's yet to battle a master like Boomi. Comparing Toph to Boomi is much like comparing Azula to Ozai or Katara to Pakku. The former of each are all very gifted prodigies, but they arn't up to par with the latter masters listed. Boomi has the skill, the intellegent mindset and the experiance that only comes from an age that Toph could never catch up to.
And to those few who have been claiming that Boomi is just some frail old man from his decades of life and that would be the Achilles Heel that makes him fall to Toph, then remember the first episode that he is seen, "The King of Omashu," and recall how ripped he revealed himself to be. He's a monsterous tank underneath those robes. His initially frail appearance is a deception of his own design.
Also, @ Tao Kong - Any compitant Earthbender could have bended aside that dust cloud that Toph had formed. But not only that, all Earthbenders can sense the earth under their feet. Toph just has it enhanced quite a bit from using it instead of sight to find her way around. I'm sure Boomi could still have found her even if he didn't make the effortless action of clearing the dust in the air.
rax95
Dec 18, 2006 18:45:12 GMT -6
Post by rax95 on Dec 18, 2006 18:45:12 GMT -6
You guys present some good points. Honestly, i think it might be a tie. We have seen how powerful Bumi is, but Toph is a master of nuetral jing. I am not really sure if Bumi is considered a master of nuetral jing. And besides, who said Toph is not in tune with the earth? Her affinity with the earth is so strong, she can make rock angels for crying out loud! And as for her only battling weak people, what about all the Dai Lee (hope thats spelled right) punks she totally pawned. I mean, the Dai Lee are like elite earthbenders.
vanga
Dec 18, 2006 19:18:12 GMT -6
Post by vanga on Dec 18, 2006 19:18:12 GMT -6
First off, when it comes to Neutral Jing: is Toph really a master in it? King Bumi ( I've been tossing between 'Bumi' and 'Boomi' and now I finally know that its the former v.v ) in Return to Omashu stated that Aang should find someone 'skilled in Neutral Jing.' That doesn't mean that Toph has mastered it. After all, she's seen alot of the time as rather 'hot-headed' one could say.
As for Bumi, he is indeed a complete master of Neutral Jing, unlike Toph. I mean, he was the one who deliberately surrendered the city of Omashu to the attacking Fire Nation army, and why? To wait for a better time to strike, from the inside (and probably to prevent as much loss of life as he could, which would have been alot if there had been a major battle). He also told Aang to leave him, because he was still waiting for the right time to fight back. If all that doesn't scream that he's a master of Neutral Jing, then I don't know what does. But then again, nothing like that backs up a claim that Toph is such a master.
As for the Dai Li, admittedly they are fairly good, but they are uniform soldiers, if above-average. They arn't noticable individuals, they are a large unit. Thus none of them are masters, or even really all that elite. You can't claim that Toph's Earthbending is great merely from knocking a bunch of enforcers with overinflated egos out of the way. Aang was using Earthbending as well during that storm on the palace and he doesn't have the ability to 'see' vibrations like Toph, but he was still doing just as good as her. In the end, the Dai Li are not what they are cracked up to be. They are above the average soldier but they are nothing higher than Intermediate.
vanga
Dec 22, 2006 21:31:44 GMT -6
Post by vanga on Dec 22, 2006 21:31:44 GMT -6
Bumi, as a master Earthbender with over a century of honing his skills, can most likely bend metal by now. Just because Toph has that whole 'blind seeing' bit, doesn't mean that one needs such a talent to bend metal. It might simply mean that she figured out how to do it much sooner than most given the advantage.
However, lets say that Bumi cannot bend metal and its an ability unique to Toph. Who cares? How much use is metalbending ever going to be? All that can be done so far is simple denting and tearing through physical contact. Perhaps someone will want to throw out that its too early to assume that's the limit of metalbending and its completely possible that more will be done with it later. This is entirely true, but if you want to start throwing out "what ifs" then you have to also accept that Bumi might also be able to bend metal as well.
Beyond all that, what does it matter if Toph can bend metal as proficiently as another bender controls their element? Its like saying that because a Firebender can bend fire and Bumi can't that they'll totally 'pawn their asses'. Even the Avatar isn't so terribly great with his currently three learned elements. Azula was putting up one heck of a fight against him in "The Drill" and all she knew was Firebending.
The truth is that the only thing we can use to gauge the pairs' chances against one another is personal skill and experiance. Bumi has the experiance by far and because of that one can only assume that his skills have been fine-tuned well above Toph's.
Once again, I'll also throw out the topic brought up by someone else over Neutral Jing. Bumi is indeed a master of it as shown by his ruling tactics, which makes it only safe to say that he carries these over into his fights. Toph has shown proficiency in Neutral Jing but she did run away from home on a whim, wishing to be free from her parents and their restricting behavior, and she also proves rather hot-headed on various occasions. Bumi could easily out wait her and attack any opennings she leaves for him. He'd never allow himself to be caught off guard while Toph would eventually be the first to tire from lack of patience and show recklessness.
In the end, I stand by the belief that Toph and the other prodigies in the show are weaker than the respective masters of their element. The only one that will surpass that point in the show I believe is Aang when he challanges Fire Lord Ozai, but at that point I'm sure he'll also be in the Avatar State and thus elevated far above his companions.
? well if he didnt thats like hard core evidence that TOPH UBER-PWNS boomi toph bent mental people she could just fricken trow metal at boomi or capture boomi in metal than PWN his ASS