dosho
Jul 22, 2006 0:59:25 GMT -6
Post by dosho on Jul 22, 2006 0:59:25 GMT -6
That’s right. Despite being mostly based on eastern influences, there are some things that could only come from the west. In case your wondering East refers to Asia (you know. middle east, Far East, East Indies) and west is America and Europe.
I noticed a huge one. The show implies that the avatar world has four basic elements. However, most of Asia (or at least China) believed in five basic elements. They are wood, water, fire, earth, and metal. So where did the idea of four elements come from then? In Greece there was a man named Empedocles (495-c. 435 BC). He created the roots for the four classical elements of Greek philosophy (Water, Earth, Fire and Air). That is where I believe the concept of four elements comes from.
Now post other western influences you have noticed.
etsuko
Jul 22, 2006 1:41:37 GMT -6
Post by etsuko on Jul 22, 2006 1:41:37 GMT -6
Actually, either than the elements, I think that the rest of the show is pretty much Asian enough. The clothes, even the Bending Moves. Because the Bending has actually something to do with the spiritual energy and the Chinese/Asians believed in that a long time ago.
Oh, I just thought of another influence. You know that in Asia, everyone has brown or dark brown eyes unless you're a mix. But if you notice, which I'm sure you do, the Waterbenders have blue eyes. Asians do not have blue eyes at all. And talk about a whole tribe of people having blue eyes.
Anonymous
Jul 30, 2006 16:30:17 GMT -6
Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2006 16:30:17 GMT -6
Yeah, it's too bad they didn't include more western influences. See the guy from the rough Rhinos with the chain ? This chain is from Europe and the Yu-Yan Archer's bow too (I think...) but I'm sure that the chain is from Europe. And, I don't know much about Asia soldiers but I think that Fire Navy uniforms aren't Asian.
jong
Jul 31, 2006 9:30:46 GMT -6
Post by jong on Jul 31, 2006 9:30:46 GMT -6
I see a huge Western Influence. Look at the weapons the Fire Nation uses. Not the weapons when it comes to hand to hand. But look at how industrialized the Fire Nation is. The tanks, the catapults, and many of their other machinations are all based off of western designs. Another more subtle thing that I find is western is the hammer. See Flat hammers like Thor's weren't in Asia even though we see it in Avatar over and over. Chinese/Asian hammers were more circular, not flat like we see.
blink
Jul 31, 2006 9:41:03 GMT -6
Post by blink on Jul 31, 2006 9:41:03 GMT -6
And then there is the pirates. I looked up Asian Pirates, and they seemed to be mostly smugglers at sea, and guerilla fighters/revolutionaries on land. Japan's way to get China to leave its business alone when the latter got a bee up its butt about sea trade and such.
The Pirates we saw on the show seem to be far more Caribean in concept, down to their parrot. (I loved that animal.)
shijin
Aug 1, 2006 12:31:19 GMT -6
Post by shijin on Aug 1, 2006 12:31:19 GMT -6
Of corse Avatar is going to have western things in it is a western made show ture its asian based but it was still made here all the creators can really do is study the asian ways and get as much as they could from that and then fill in the rest with their own things like some of the exsamples you guys have put
Anonymous
Aug 1, 2006 20:31:03 GMT -6
Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2006 20:31:03 GMT -6
Yes thank you Etsuko I have always wondered that and another thing why are the waterbenders so dark I mean you think that being in the cold they would develope a lighter complection. Then again does dark skin protect UV rays better than lighter skin?
As for the technology in my opinion the Fire Nation is going through an industrial revolution, and considering, as far as I know, that the Asiatic world didn't go through one(not until those damn Europeans came and tried to make everyone like them, due to their inable to accept the cleaner world) and was thus inable to develop their architecture into the machinery they had to get it from some place. Right?
Has anyone noticed that many characters do not have an asian appearance? I mean in the original drawings Aang looked asian.
jong
Aug 2, 2006 5:17:52 GMT -6
Post by jong on Aug 2, 2006 5:17:52 GMT -6
And you know if we really choose to think about it, thats the only reason that the Fire Nation is winning this war. Because they have superior weaponry and machines they can lay waste to the whole Avatar world. I mean if you look at it, the only technological thing I've seen the Earthbenders use are those big Earth coins, which are very useful. But other than that all they have is the darned ostrich-horses.
dosho
Aug 2, 2006 23:50:59 GMT -6
Post by dosho on Aug 2, 2006 23:50:59 GMT -6
I've noticed that too. In fact the people that have the greatest resemblance to Asians are the air nomads. In the quest for more western influences I've noticed it in the names. The Boulder=the Rock. The Rough Rhinos= Theodore Roosevelt’s Rough Riders. Finally, (though I have zero evidence) I think that the omasu mail system has some western roots. Must do more research when I'm not busy.....
yi
Aug 9, 2006 8:04:24 GMT -6
Post by yi on Aug 9, 2006 8:04:24 GMT -6
I think the drawings are made to look appealing, like anime. Thank god they didn't make avatar like the other cartoons. But it is interesting on how people take their view upon things, I find water tribes not asian but more like Aboriginals in north pole. Note the resemblence of their clothing. Other than that all the cloths are traditional asian cloths, yes fire navy uniforms are asian arm uniforms. But it really doesn't matter whether the show has western infulences or not, it's good show nontheless, and thank god the drawing is similar to anime
Anonymous
Aug 16, 2006 18:25:24 GMT -6
Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2006 18:25:24 GMT -6
Ooh did not know that Nice one akailen. The four temples correspond with the directions. The people in the Swamp had a Mississippi Delta acent, and I am sure no Asiatic place does.
And Do Sho didn't know that, so many similarities than again the Fire Nation does kind of ressemble Britain.
sorax
Aug 16, 2006 19:01:55 GMT -6
Post by sorax on Aug 16, 2006 19:01:55 GMT -6
The moves for the bending come from martial arts. Toph uses a preying mantis style of Kung Fu and the rest are japanese martial arts.Or they could be chinese I have a bad memory.
ren
Aug 16, 2006 23:20:35 GMT -6
Post by ren on Aug 16, 2006 23:20:35 GMT -6
Firebending is Northern Xiaolin Kung Fu, Earthbending is Hung Gar Waterbending is Tai-Chi and Airbending is Ba Qua. These are all forms of Chinese Martial Arts I believe, Not Japanese.
Aug 18, 2006 2:04:16 GMT -6
Post by A Long Display Name Here on Aug 18, 2006 2:04:16 GMT -6
As for waterbenders, there's a bit of the asian influence in them, despite their dark skin, going back to the Ice Age. A few of the "indian" tribes (what US people consider to be "Native Americans") traveled across an ice bridge over the Bering Strait (between Russia and Alaska) and into the US. Some stayed in the area known now as Alaska, and we know them as Eskimos. The dark skin is also rather Pacific Islander-y......
And yes, the Fire Nation does remind me a lot of Europe, especially Great Britain, during the era of their industrial revolution. If you notice, their ships move on coal, which was a big thing in Britain - really, all over the Western world. Everything ran on coal.
Cool thing about the connection with Roosevelt's Rough Riders. *thumbs up*
dardra
Aug 19, 2006 8:13:08 GMT -6
Post by dardra on Aug 19, 2006 8:13:08 GMT -6
The setting of the series seems to be in a pre industrial time, except of the fire nation, who is predestined for industry and blanc because of fire bending as a source of heat.
Coal heated steam machines have been the state of technology in the nineteenth century. So they have been used all around Europe and America. And in the Asian area too, where the western had already brought their 'civilization'. (Please note the inverted commas)
Only at the end of the nineteenth century, the gasoline motor had been invented, and electricity to be used as common also.
I like the anime allusions. And I think the series is a good mixture of western an eastern elements.
kabuto
Aug 19, 2006 16:29:08 GMT -6
Post by kabuto on Aug 19, 2006 16:29:08 GMT -6
Little note, the show Avatar doesn't draw the four elements from Greece. But actually from India. It draws on the five classic indian elements. Which are fire, earth, water and air. The fifth one is Akasha/spirit I believe.
dosho
Aug 20, 2006 1:37:42 GMT -6
Post by dosho on Aug 20, 2006 1:37:42 GMT -6
Sorry commerada, but I went back and looked at it. The Indian elements started out as three; Fire, water and Earth. Later on, they would be more like the Greeks when air came from the fire. And finally, that fifth element you were referring to is actually part of the Buddhist Elements and it's not Akash or sprit. It is void and as far as I can tell there isn't a class of void benders. But good try at finding some new stuff. Keep up the good work.
kabuto
Aug 20, 2006 11:55:35 GMT -6
Post by kabuto on Aug 20, 2006 11:55:35 GMT -6
Avatar draws on four of the five classical Indian elements of Hindu and Buddhist traditions for the four bending arts: Fire (agni or tejas), Water (ap or jala), Earth (prithvi or bhumi), and Wind or Air (vayu or pavan). The fifth, aether (akasha or akash) is symbolized by Aang as an intermediary of the Spirit World. Some names in the series, such as "Agni Kai" and King Bumi the Earthbender, borrow directly from these elements.
Edit:: I just copied that off of the wikipedia, lol.
randir
Sept 18, 2006 0:55:25 GMT -6
Post by randir on Sept 18, 2006 0:55:25 GMT -6
Well mainly this show is concentrated on a certain spot in ancient chinese civilization, the Zhou dynastys. Within the zhou dynasty they belived that all must be equal, the yin and yang concept. by then they created the 4 different states, but all was still china, these 4 states were Qi (east), Chu (south,, Qin (west), and Jin (north). To create a unity within this country, if one side warred witht he another, the other two would have to. In this time the avatar represented the yin and yang, the unity between the states. That was just the pre story of the avatar.
Now the present time of the avatar shows more of the Qin dynasty, in which the great wall was build. The fire nation, resembling the invading barbarions, had great success in the beginning, but then the great wall was built to defend china from the north.
But the the devices used as said by western influences could possibly be false, designers create their models and do not need to research it.
and as to the question with the darker skin with the water tribe, no they would not produce lighter skin colors. Ice and snow is a form of water, thus holding the properties of water, like reflection. Compared to a person laying on a beach without any shade and a person swimming in the ocean, which will get burned more easily? the answer is the person swimming in the ocean because of water's reflective property, which will magnify the sun's uv rays. the water tribe had to evolve into a darker skinned people or else they would have been constantly burned, just like africans developed black skin. yes even though it is not hot, your skin can still suffer from the sun.
